Taekwando to Ju-Jitsu - Ultimate Jujitsu

Author	Comments
DudeKidFireEater Newbie 1 posts	Thursday 3rd March 2005 at 00:03 I'm 18 years old and really wanted to start with Ju-Jitsu lessons. Unfortunately, where I am now, that's not possible. The only martial arts I can take on a good level (meaning competitent instructors, good rep) is Taekwondo. If I were to take it for several years, and then switch to Ju-Jitsu, how big would the leap be. Would it at least help me learning Ju-Jitsu eventually...or maybe even hinder it? Thanks. Word up, yo.
sl Resident 855 posts	Thursday 3rd March 2005 at 11:31 From what i know about TKD it's a striking art . Where as jitsu is more a throwing, locking type of art with bjj more on the grappling side. Not sure the cross would be any good. ______________________________
catsshoulddrinkwhiskey Newbie 5 posts	Thursday 3rd March 2005 at 11:43 there isnt much traditional tkd that'd help with jujitsu but where i learnt it the teacher incoporated some close range self defense techniques that were maybe first few lessons standard jujitsu eg.basic sweeps,defences,etc but no ,major throws or ground work.judo would be more useful
sl Resident 855 posts	Thursday 3rd March 2005 at 12:07 Yeah Judo would be good. ______________________________
DataTek Newbie 7 posts	Thursday 3rd March 2005 at 13:32 I've also gone over from (ITF) TKD to JJ. I'd reached my red belt with black stripe and had to stop, and now I've been doing JJ for 3-4 months. It is true that a lot of my TKD training didn't help much in JJ, but some elements did, and do, help me: My sparring is much better than that of many of the others [up to the point where they grab me ;-) ], and I'm certainly one of the more flexible ones. Your kicking and punching techniques can certainly be incorporated into the 'striking' phase of JJ sparring. P.S I've just joined and this is my first post. Happy to be here. ------------------------------
Robsco 1319 posts	Thursday 3rd March 2005 at 18:58 Looks like 3 new joiners on this one thread! Welcome all. As for the topic, I've always seen TKD as fancy high kicks, obviously the basic sparring will help in traditional Ju-Jitsu, but none of the fancy stuff. The Admin Guy
Nathan Addict 175 posts	Friday 4th March 2005 at 14:51 No training is bad training. There's no such thing as a bad martial art. _____________________________
Ryu Regular 47 posts	Saturday 12th March 2005 at 19:45 I used to think of TKD as just a lot of fancy stuff, with the high kicks etc. This was until a TKD chap joined our mat and I had to fight him, I've never seen kicks and punches so accurate! ;-) (or come in from so many directions, ouch!) My (hastily) revised opinion is that its a good complement to JJ, it'll teach you the punches and kicks that JJ dosent concentrate on, Although Muai Thai will do this better methinks. It does however leave you vulnerable when the fight gets to close quarters, as my opponent discovered! ;-) Ken is good, but Ryu is bett
ninja9578 Regular 92 posts	Thursday 17th March 2005 at 00:11 I had to switch to an upright sparring style similar to TKD because of a health problem with my JJ instructor. The upright styles allow simple locks and holds for short periods of times (grabbing a roundhouse kick and locking it for a second is legal) and that helps you score in free sparring. I don't think my upright sparring has helped my grappling at all though. JJ -> TKD good TKD -> JJ couldn't hurt, but doesn't help much either Blue Belt - Gracie JJ 3rd Degree Black Belt - Shorin Ryu Red Belt w/ two stripes - Soo Bahk Do
sinner619 Newbie 2 posts	Friday 18th March 2005 at 13:46 Hi people. I'm new to the forum too so that makes 4 now! I started traditional JuJitsu 6 months ago having previously run myself up to black tag in TKD. Aside from the fact I haven't trained in TKD for about 8 years, it's still been beneficial - whatever art you do, it's always useful to learn how to take some knocks. If there's no JuJitsu club near you - go do TKD instead. Personally I don't think it's as good as JJ but it's gotta be better than watching tv right?
andy Resident 729 posts	Friday 18th March 2005 at 18:09 TKD is good if you want to go to the olympics. thats all. "no weapon formed against me shall prosper"
ninja9578 Regular 92 posts	Sunday 20th March 2005 at 01:14 If you wanna learn how to defend yourself then forget about TKD. Very very rarely will you ever find a TKD class that does any practical self defense. Mine does, but only because the instructor is a cop and knows what it takes to survive on the street. Just FYI, he is very non-traditional and usually incorporated JJ techniques anyway. TKD for looking like you can fight. JJ or Krav Maga for being able to fight. Blue Belt - Gracie JJ 3rd Degree Black Belt - Shorin Ryu Red Belt w/ two stripes - Soo Bahk Do
DataTek Newbie 7 posts	Thursday 24th March 2005 at 07:51 I was going to say something on how the posters of those last few puerile (and mostly uninformed) comments should not confuse original ITF TKD with the sporting WTF TKD.....but why bother? It'd be off-topic anyway. ------------------------------
crazymofo55 Regular 41 posts	Friday 25th March 2005 at 19:06 The problem with TKD is that strikers often lose to grapplers unless they have good takedown defense or a knee strike ready to meet the dome of the guy shooting in. When punching, kicking, whatever the center of gravity won't be as good as the grapplers and a one time closing in of the range will spell doom for the striker. TKD may work best or as good for tactics in two ranges (punching, kicking), but does not satisfy the other two (trapping, ground). TKD works alot of kicks, but a grappler will come in low and impenatrable to get inside. If a kick misses or gets countered the fight will go straight on the mat. If they duck a punch or simply create a good distraction on approach... mat. Against a ground fighter there's alot of punishment to be dealt down there and unless they've learned a couple good sweeps it'll be like a flies on a dog turd the rest of the fight. I just believe kickboxing is the better style for practical fighting because it utilizes the clinch more.
andy Resident 729 posts	Saturday 26th March 2005 at 07:57 datatek is getting touchy, one statement to make you think..... 'kicking some one to the head is about as much use as punching someone in the foot' thoughts? "no weapon formed against me shall prosper"
alski Regular 73 posts	Saturday 26th March 2005 at 14:54 surely if the kick makes contact it has its use? ok if you miss you leave yourself wide open to a counter,but sometimes it must worth having a pop at it if the oppertunity is there?
Ryu Regular 47 posts	Saturday 26th March 2005 at 15:26 With respect Andy dude, I understand the poing your making, but the phrase dosent make sense! Head: Contains Brain, Eyes, Ears etc and houses the ability to balance, move, hand-eye coordination, all of everything you'd need in a fight, making it a good target for the opponent. Foot: Contains err..bone, erm...muscle, um....tendon etc, houses the ability to aah... kick someone to the head??????:-o No offence chap, couldn't resist the comparison!! :-)) Ken is good, but Ryu is bett
trevek2 Addict 119 posts	Sunday 27th March 2005 at 13:46 What if you kick them in the head while they are lying down? Point to note, whereas WTF TKD is predominantly legs (at least in competition), Chang Hon (ITF-style) TKD is nearer to many karate styles in that there is a greater emphasis in hand technique, particularly in competition sparring where you can kick to the head (it was partly based on Shotokan in the beginning). To say that it is no good would also put many karate styles in the same boat. The initial patterns in the chang Hon syllabus focus more on hand technique, elbows and low kicks than they do on high kicks. As for the practical combat applications, this is predominantly down to the instructors. My instructor in Glasgow taught combat technique and some grappling/lock work. When I trained with WTF in Finland in the early 1980's I found the Helsinki club also focussed on defence against wrestling technique. This was nothing to do with UFC, it was due to the traditional popularity of wrestling in northern europe and the number of street fighters who were wrestlers. There was also an emphasis on low kicks as high kicks in a slippery icy winter aint a good idea! So, what's my point? Well, TKD has it's uses. If you train TKD it can make you fit and fast, however, the problem comes with utilising different ranges. A judo guy once asked me if I did karate as I tended to keep him at arms distance. A boxer, he said, would pull him in closer. If you aint got Jujitsu locally, why not train TKD. Better than nothing and you'll get used to getting hit. Oh, don't believe the stories that WTF can't handle a close-up head punching attack. try it and watch out for the nasty (or lovely, depending on where you are) short range spinning kick at mid-section. See how well I block all your
Spooky Man Newbie 1 posts	Monday 28th March 2005 at 15:38 As an ITF Tae Kwon-Do black belt, who has recently taken up ju-jitsu as well I thought I'd weigh in. Comparing one martial art to another is completly subjective, no one can ever claim that one art is better than another. All have their strength's and weaknesses, but when it comes down to it - the average prat on the street doesn't stand much of a chance against a black belt from any style. And two black belts should never end up in a street fight, if there is one thing that all martial arts teach, it is that fighting is a last resort... In answer to the original post, transferring between TKD and Jitsu has not been that easy, they are very different styles, but if you take the level of discipline & fitness required for TKD into Jitsu you are in a much better position than most novices... Also, I think most of the jitsu people I have trained with have been caught completly off guard when I have aimed a kick at head height... ------------------------------
sl Resident 855 posts	Tuesday 29th March 2005 at 11:21 Didnt think there was any clinch work involved in kick boxing there is with muay thai ..... (Hope your not getting confused) However my view is TKD Vs Muay Thai.... Muay Thai wins by shin to face..:-p ______________________________

Author

Comments

Newbie

1 posts

Thursday 3rd March 2005 at 00:03

I'm 18 years old and really wanted to start with Ju-Jitsu lessons. Unfortunately, where I am now, that's not possible. The only martial arts I can take on a good level (meaning competitent instructors, good rep) is Taekwondo. If I were to take it for several years, and then switch to Ju-Jitsu, how big would the leap be. Would it at least help me learning Ju-Jitsu eventually...or maybe even hinder it?

Thanks.

Word up, yo.

Resident

855 posts

Thursday 3rd March 2005 at 11:31

From what i know about TKD it's a striking art . Where as jitsu is more a throwing, locking type of art with bjj more on the grappling side. Not sure the cross would be any good.

______________________________

catsshoulddrinkwhiskey

Newbie

5 posts

Thursday 3rd March 2005 at 11:43

there isnt much traditional tkd that'd help with jujitsu but where i learnt it the teacher incoporated some close range self defense techniques that were maybe first few lessons standard jujitsu eg.basic sweeps,defences,etc but no ,major throws or ground work.judo would be more useful

Resident

855 posts

Thursday 3rd March 2005 at 12:07

Yeah Judo would be good.

______________________________

DataTek

Newbie

7 posts

Thursday 3rd March 2005 at 13:32

I've also gone over from (ITF) TKD to JJ.

I'd reached my red belt with black stripe and had to stop, and now I've been doing JJ for 3-4 months.

It is true that a lot of my TKD training didn't help much in JJ, but some elements did, and do, help me: My sparring is much better than that of many of the others [up to the point where they grab me ;-) ], and I'm certainly one of the more flexible ones.

Your kicking and punching techniques can certainly be incorporated into the 'striking' phase of JJ sparring.

P.S I've just joined and this is my first post. Happy to be here.

------------------------------

Robsco

1319 posts

Thursday 3rd March 2005 at 18:58

Looks like 3 new joiners on this one thread! Welcome all.

As for the topic, I've always seen TKD as fancy high kicks, obviously the basic sparring will help in traditional Ju-Jitsu, but none of the fancy stuff.

The Admin Guy

Nathan

Addict

175 posts

Friday 4th March 2005 at 14:51

No training is bad training. There's no such thing as a bad martial art.

_____________________________

Ryu

Regular

47 posts

Saturday 12th March 2005 at 19:45

I used to think of TKD as just a lot of fancy stuff, with the high kicks etc. This was until a TKD chap joined our mat and I had to fight him, I've never seen kicks and punches so accurate! ;-) (or come in from so many directions, ouch!)

My (hastily) revised opinion is that its a good complement to JJ, it'll teach you the punches and kicks that JJ dosent concentrate on, Although Muai Thai will do this better methinks. It does however leave you vulnerable when the fight gets to close quarters, as my opponent discovered! ;-)

Ken is good, but Ryu is bett

ninja9578

Regular

92 posts

Thursday 17th March 2005 at 00:11

I had to switch to an upright sparring style similar to TKD because of a health problem with my JJ instructor. The upright styles allow simple locks and holds for short periods of times (grabbing a roundhouse kick and locking it for a second is legal) and that helps you score in free sparring. I don't think my upright sparring has helped my grappling at all though.

JJ -> TKD good
TKD -> JJ couldn't hurt, but doesn't help much either

Blue Belt - Gracie JJ
3rd Degree Black Belt - Shorin Ryu
Red Belt w/ two stripes - Soo Bahk Do

sinner619

Newbie

2 posts

Friday 18th March 2005 at 13:46

Hi people. I'm new to the forum too so that makes 4 now! I started traditional JuJitsu 6 months ago having previously run myself up to black tag in TKD. Aside from the fact I haven't trained in TKD for about 8 years, it's still been beneficial - whatever art you do, it's always useful to learn how to take some knocks. If there's no JuJitsu club near you - go do TKD instead. Personally I don't think it's as good as JJ but it's gotta be better than watching tv right?

andy

Resident

729 posts

Friday 18th March 2005 at 18:09

TKD is good if you want to go to the olympics.

thats all.

"no weapon formed against me shall prosper"

ninja9578

Regular

92 posts

Sunday 20th March 2005 at 01:14

If you wanna learn how to defend yourself then forget about TKD. Very very rarely will you ever find a TKD class that does any practical self defense. Mine does, but only because the instructor is a cop and knows what it takes to survive on the street. Just FYI, he is very non-traditional and usually incorporated JJ techniques anyway. TKD for looking like you can fight. JJ or Krav Maga for being able to fight.

Blue Belt - Gracie JJ
3rd Degree Black Belt - Shorin Ryu
Red Belt w/ two stripes - Soo Bahk Do

DataTek

Newbie

7 posts

Thursday 24th March 2005 at 07:51

I was going to say something on how the posters of those last few puerile (and mostly uninformed) comments should not confuse original ITF TKD with the sporting WTF TKD.....but why bother? It'd be off-topic anyway.

------------------------------

crazymofo55

Regular

41 posts

Friday 25th March 2005 at 19:06

The problem with TKD is that strikers often lose to grapplers unless they have good takedown defense or a knee strike ready to meet the dome of the guy shooting in. When punching, kicking, whatever the center of gravity won't be as good as the grapplers and a one time closing in of the range will spell doom for the striker. TKD may work best or as good for tactics in two ranges (punching, kicking), but does not satisfy the other two (trapping, ground).
TKD works alot of kicks, but a grappler will come in low and impenatrable to get inside. If a kick misses or gets countered the fight will go straight on the mat. If they duck a punch or simply create a good distraction on approach... mat. Against a ground fighter there's alot of punishment to be dealt down there and unless they've learned a couple good sweeps it'll be like a flies on a dog turd the rest of the fight. I just believe kickboxing is the better style for practical fighting because it utilizes the clinch more.

andy

Resident

729 posts

Saturday 26th March 2005 at 07:57

datatek is getting touchy, one statement to make you think.....

'kicking some one to the head is about as much use as punching someone in the foot'

thoughts?

"no weapon formed against me shall prosper"

alski

Regular

73 posts

Saturday 26th March 2005 at 14:54

surely if the kick makes contact it has its use? ok if you miss you leave yourself wide open to a counter,but sometimes it must worth having a pop at it if the oppertunity is there?

Ryu

Regular

47 posts

Saturday 26th March 2005 at 15:26

With respect Andy dude, I understand the poing your making, but the phrase dosent make sense!

Head: Contains Brain, Eyes, Ears etc and houses the ability to balance, move, hand-eye coordination, all of everything you'd need in a fight, making it a good target for the opponent.

Foot: Contains err..bone, erm...muscle, um....tendon etc, houses the ability to aah... kick someone to the head??????:-o

No offence chap, couldn't resist the comparison!! :-))

Ken is good, but Ryu is bett

trevek2

Addict

119 posts

Sunday 27th March 2005 at 13:46

What if you kick them in the head while they are lying down?
Point to note, whereas WTF TKD is predominantly legs (at least in competition), Chang Hon (ITF-style) TKD is nearer to many karate styles in that there is a greater emphasis in hand technique, particularly in competition sparring where you can kick to the head (it was partly based on Shotokan in the beginning). To say that it is no good would also put many karate styles in the same boat. The initial patterns in the chang Hon syllabus focus more on hand technique, elbows and low kicks than they do on high kicks.

As for the practical combat applications, this is predominantly down to the instructors. My instructor in Glasgow taught combat technique and some grappling/lock work. When I trained with WTF in Finland in the early 1980's I found the Helsinki club also focussed on defence against wrestling technique. This was nothing to do with UFC, it was due to the traditional popularity of wrestling in northern europe and the number of street fighters who were wrestlers. There was also an emphasis on low kicks as high kicks in a slippery icy winter aint a good idea!

So, what's my point? Well, TKD has it's uses. If you train TKD it can make you fit and fast, however, the problem comes with utilising different ranges. A judo guy once asked me if I did karate as I tended to keep him at arms distance. A boxer, he said, would pull him in closer.

If you aint got Jujitsu locally, why not train TKD. Better than nothing and you'll get used to getting hit.

Oh, don't believe the stories that WTF can't handle a close-up head punching attack. try it and watch out for the nasty (or lovely, depending on where you are) short range spinning kick at mid-section.

See how well I block all your

Spooky Man

Newbie

1 posts

Monday 28th March 2005 at 15:38

As an ITF Tae Kwon-Do black belt, who has recently taken up ju-jitsu as well I thought I'd weigh in.

Comparing one martial art to another is completly subjective, no one can ever claim that one art is better than another. All have their strength's and weaknesses, but when it comes down to it - the average prat on the street doesn't stand much of a chance against a black belt from any style. And two black belts should never end up in a street fight, if there is one thing that all martial arts teach, it is that fighting is a last resort...

In answer to the original post, transferring between TKD and Jitsu has not been that easy, they are very different styles, but if you take the level of discipline & fitness required for TKD into Jitsu you are in a much better position than most novices...

Also, I think most of the jitsu people I have trained with have been caught completly off guard when I have aimed a kick at head height...

------------------------------

Resident

855 posts

Tuesday 29th March 2005 at 11:21

Didnt think there was any clinch work involved in kick boxing there is with muay thai ..... (Hope your not getting confused)

However my view is TKD Vs Muay Thai.... Muay Thai wins by shin to face..:-p

______________________________